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I just bought this machine today from auction. It arrives later this week. I was wondering if anyone could tell me some things about this machine.

I have attached some images and a few queries I have. Hoping someone may have some knowledge of this machine.









- Why does it look like there are 2 hopper tubes (One brown and thin and one yellow)?



- What is this part?

- On some other photos I have seen of this machine there was an extra part under the reels but this one has empty space. Is something missing or is it a different mechanism?
- The payout structure seems very strange 2,4,6,10,10,10,£1,£10. Does this mean the 10 would pay out £2 as its 10x20p?

Many thanks in advance!

- T

I am totally the wrong person to answer your queries as I know nothing about Ballys.....

So it is a modified Bally machine as written by Greaves who were well know for creating new themes on old Bally machines, often with special features like Haunted House. Do a search for Greaves and you will see on this site.

Originally would have had a hopper at bottom for payouts, now all in door with solenoids and pay tubes. They also put small payout cups on as part of conversion.

The numbers on payout will relate to the number of coins, so yes 10 coins wins £2. The bigger tube is for the larger wins, as mentioned, £10 and £1 and looks like it would be hand fill 50p coins (I think that is what it states).

The part you mention on the door, looks like a small motor. I wonder if this is a special light feature behind the panel which maybe rotates some discs to create effects from the front....

It's a well-known Greaves conversion of a Bally, but it's been hacked-about at a later date.
There was talk of it on the MPU Mecca, at one time. These machines are a sort-of 'half-way house' between 'our' machines, and the electro-mechanicals.
Neither Forum does them justice.

Thanks for the replies guys!

How difficult is it to change those payouts values around?

A motor sounds likely as I think that bottom panel has a fire style light effects. I initially thought it was a speaker, not sure if this has sound or not?

When you say "hacked-about" which bits are you referring to.

I would really like to clean the whole machine up and also sort out the main panel as it has some parts where it looks like the paint has chipped.



Is this printed directly on the glass or are the graphics a removable sheet that I can easily replace?

Tom

when you say you want to change the payouts (a) what to and (b) for what reason?

I've had earlier Bally machines with a similar motor to drive the light effects. Quite often they stopped working years before the machine was taken out of service, but the operators never bothered to replace them. The early ones you could get into; these later ones I don't know. They run such a light spin that they are often simply gummed up with dirt and a clean will start them running again. Like I said, IF you can get into it.

It would be fair to say the machine was hacked about first by Greaves and, perhaps, later as well. It really boils down to a different glass and totally different style of paying out from the original machine, first with payouts (and perhaps the coinage) changed later.

The heat from old style lighting over many years has caused the paint to flake on the payout glass. At least you can repair this to some degree but it's hit and miss. I can make replacements if you ever need them, PM me if interested.

As Bingham says, this is at the very end of the old style electro mechanicals and the start of the fully electric controlled semi mechanicals and falls at the very end of the era we cover (but it just creeps in. )

I think it seems odd that lesser value symbols pay out more. £2 for the lower ones and £1 for the higher ones? Given that's based off the awful paytable graphic that could be changed?

I am all for cleaning the machine and de-greasing it to get it on good working order. I don't mind the work, but only so much is within my skill base.

The glass that has the graphics on outside the slot reels seems in pretty rough shape. This sort of thing is way outside my capability. Are you able to re-create something that looks new for that? Would love to get new decals and get the whole machine looking like new. If so, then let me know what that would cost and I am sure we can work something out there.

Would love to talk with some of you guys via Skype or whatever chat you use to keep up to date. If that's a possibility then let me know.

- T

The machine has been converted by a home punter to these payouts, probably because the payouts appeared so low on original 2p. It would never have been arcade operated on 20p play because it wouldn't have taken enough money to justify the licence duty, and it wouldn't have had a £10 cash jackpot during its operating life, probably only a 50p jackpot.
The updated decals used are borrowed from later AWP conversion kits. The payout structure is all over the place as it's a home 'conversion', altered probably to make it a more attractive sell.

The best thing to do would be to try and find out what a 'new' Greaves Fire Bell looked like, and restore it to that condition.
The Greaves conversions are, to my mind, a collector's item in their own right, and after you have enjoyed completing this one, you will no doubt want to try a 'Showman', or one of the other Greaves types.
To restore this to the original Bally form would be a thankless task; it isn't even clear which model Bally it started out as!
The glass will be the hardest part to get right. The rest is just hardware.

moonriver wrote: ↑Tue Nov 19, 2019 2:15 am The machine has been converted by a home punter to these payouts, probably because the payouts appeared so low on original 2p. It would never have been arcade operated on 20p play because it wouldn't have taken enough money to justify the licence duty, and it wouldn't have had a £10 cash jackpot during its operating life, probably only a 50p jackpot.
The updated decals used are borrowed from later AWP conversion kits. The payout structure is all over the place as it's a home 'conversion', altered probably to make it a more attractive sell.

How would I go about changing those payout values around? Will it require me to re-program chips and if so what would I need to accomplish that?

- T

I'd have to look at the machine to work out how Greaves arranged the solenoid payouts. It certainly doesn't involve chips.
Is it in working order? If so you can always watch what happens when it pays out, and work it out from there. It will involve contacts and relays, but little else.
The only solenoid-pay Bally conversions I'm familiar with are the well-known Gold Awards, and have but two payouts: One pulse to the 2x6d slide (pay 1/-), or one pulse to the Gold Award slide (pay one 5/- token).
Yours will be slightly more complicated; but not much!

First thing to do is check exactly what it's paying now and on what symbols, then decide what you want it to do. If you're just switching things around (three bells pays 2 and 3 cherries pays 5 and you want it the other way round) it SHOULD be easy. If you want to change the payouts to something new, that could be another matter.

Conversion and restoration of this machine is now complete!

Work Done:

• Cleaned and serviced the entire machine

• 3D printed new door tubes to convert to £1 payout

• Fixed the hopper unit so it pays out for all wins (Was not paying out on some wins before)

• Cleaned off old glass illustrations

• Created new graphics in Photoshop for all 3 glass pieces and got them printed

• Created new reel strips

• Re-soldered wiring on the main mech boards for better contacts

• Increased RTP from 40% to 71%

• Added front lights to the bottom part of the reel glass

• Re-painted metal top in black

• New black plastic front with new Bally and 20p decals

• Replaced top bulb to be smart bulb with light effects

• Polished all Chrome and removed dents

• Replaced all missing screws

• Replaced all bulbs

• Added new door lock bracket and barrel so it locks

- T

Well it won't pass muster for the bandit purists but at least it was a conversion already. I do like it, the graphics turned out really well. Good job.
Hope you saved the original glasses!

Nice to see a Christmas-themed machine without Ol' Beardy shoving his face in.
Will you be making alternative glasses for the rest of the year?

That is absolutely fabulous. Brilliant. Well done!!!

It looks very professionally done; you might get yourself a job with Libertygames as they do this type of revamp. I have an old Aristocrat Arcadian mk1 awaiting a bit of welding on a broken part. The reel strips are worn out, it all looks rather tired and not really going to realize value I put into it if taken back to original condition, so contemplated doing something a bit way out there too. Thanks for sharing.