Mills Black Cherry Flavour

[bod]

Hi everyone,

I've been following the forum as a guest for a few months but without a machine of my own I didn't have much to contribute. Now I've just purchased a Mills Black Cherry and so I've joined the forum to give you all a laugh at my attempts to understand how it all works.

Now I know the first thing you will all say is it isn't a genuine Mills because all the bits aren't stamped MLB and I get a payout of 2 for a single cherry. Fact is, I don't really mind. I'm not anal about the authenticity of every screw and spring, and it means if I take it apart and can't get it back together then I'm not depriving mankind of a priceless antique. I like the look of it, and it makes noises and pays out money when my fruits align. so to speak.

However the mech hasn't been touched for a while and needs a bit of a clean. Partly why I bought it really, I'm keen to understand the mechanical operation as it fascinated me as a kid and I always wanted to own one. I've stripped and cleaned the escalator and I think I see how that works (apart from the upper long lever which I'm not worried about at present).

The machine basically works and pays out OK, but I've identified 2 problems. Firstly it will play without a coin, but I can see why this is. The main mech unit has been oiled but the oil has turned to treacle and the lever that sticks up and pushes the 'has chummy put a coin in?' lever on the escalator isn't moving. I'm sure once I clean the main mech this will start working properly.

My second problem is that when I line up 3 bars, the payout slides pay OK, but the jackpot doesn't trip. I can trip it manually by moving a lever upwards, and I've removed and cleaned the jackpot unit , so I think that seems to work OK. However I can't really see what part on the main mech is supposed to trip and then reset the jackpot. I'm wondering if I'm one lever short of a payout? (people think I am for buying a machine in the first place, but I don't care). The only thing I can see that might touch the jackpot unit is a C shaped lever with a spring on it, but this just seems to see-saw and the other end of it bangs into the clock fan to stop it turning. I'm uploading a couple of photos of my gubbins in the hope someone can shed some light on the issue for me.

Thanks for your help
Bod

[badpenny]

Hi bod and welcome to our "Do'ings"

Congrats on taking the plunge, it sounds as if you're already enjoying your new bestest ever friend ..... I hope you have enough room for more.

It also appears you have a degree in bodge-ometry which to be honest is all you need, that and an inquiring mind. So far as your jackpot is concerned it's tripped when all of the slides retract and the little post protruding from the top slide lifts the lever that is also attached to the top of the slides' cage. That rises and flicks the lever on the side of the JP. So the horizontal movement of the top slide transfers to a vertical movement to free the JP. Often it stops working because somebody has not replaced the base plate inside the cabinet far enough forward for the lever to reach the trip. You can slacken the retaining bolts and slide it to adjust.

The mechanism all looks nice and clean, but you really want to clean all of the old grease off, you don't want grease anywhere on it, just a light machine oil like 3in 1. Don't oil anywhere a coin goes especially the slides.

Also you have a loose coin sitting to right of the payout tube, don't leave loose coins in place they can jam things up some'at nasty they can.

Thanks for showing us, good luck and keep in touch.

Badpenny

[bod]

Aha, some words of wisdom from a voice of experience.
Thanks very much for that, I'd seen that lever but couldn't see how anything could actuate it. I had no idea the whole slide assembly with the post on it would move like that.
So, now I'm confident that I have all the right bits, I'll take it apart to clean the grease and oil off it, then see how many bits I have left when I put it back together

Thanks again, I'm sure you will hear more from me soon, hopefully to tell you it all works.

Bod

[badpenny]

After dismantling and remantling a bandit you should have ....
One coach bolt
One bloodied knuckle
Three short machine screws
Two springs (one of which will be overstretched with a kinked coil a third of the way down).
.... left over.

Keep them safe in a takeaway container forever ...... you'll never need any of it again, however it is our responsibility to maintain these historical remnants for future generations.

BP

[bod]

Well I already have that sixpence you spotted, so the machine didn't cost as much as I thought after all.
I can also see a few overstretched springs waiting for me, so I know I'm on the right track. And I think by the time I get it back together I'm more likely to get a bus pass than a coach bolt...
As for a bloodied knuckle, how does a blood-blistered thumb nail rate? I got it trapped in the main spring when I activated the mech by hand earlier to test the jackpot trip. And I can tell you that it jolly well hurts, quite a lot. I could tell you how much it really hurts but I think this post may be removed sharpish if I did.

Bod

[bod]

Aha! I managed to find some time yesterday to pull some of the main mech apart to clean it. I took all the levers off the side and a couple off the back, but stopped short of the payout levers and slides. I ran out of obvious screws to undo, so I chickened out before I had too many bits on the newspaper to ever get back together in the right order. Anyway the payout works so I don't have to worry about that until I'm more confident of what I'm doing.

The grease that had been helpfully applied to some of the moving parts had set to the consistency of beeswax but I washed all this off with a few gallons of petrol, which has the dual advantage of degreasing the parts and then warming them as they catch fire...

Anyway, managed to get it all back together with the loss of only 1 cotter pin - and no bits left over to save in a jar.
Which brings me to the point of this post. Now the main mech is cycling correctly I can look at the jackpot trip, which was my original problem. I can see how it is supposed to work, thanks to BP's reply, but it isn't moving properly. On close inspection the lever seems to have been extended slightly with a small bit soldered to the end (see my pic 1 above) so I'm assuming it is a historical problem. Also the lever seems to lie too low (resting on the slides) so when that slide post retracts on a jackpot win, instead of sliding under the 'ramp' and raising the lever it just smacks into the end of it. Should there be anything on the other end of that lever to hold it more horizontally and stop it from just sagging onto top of the slide assembly? Difficult to really see the the pivot and other end of the lever as it is right in the centre of the mech - suppose I should have dismantled a bit more of the mech afer all?

[badpenny]

Hearty congratulations on the blood blister, you are truly on the way to a Diploma in 3 reeler butchery.

Can you post a photo .....
* of the other side of the jackpot release lever as it lays on top of the slides?
* of your wife/girlfriend doing something similar?

[bod]

I asked them both and they declined, which only left the au pair, who was more game than I had expected. Pretty good photos I thought, and far too good to share with you, so I've only uploaded the photos of the slottie.

As you can see, the ramp part of the lever bumps into the side of the pillar, rather than riding up on top on it.

Bod

[badpenny]

That looks ok to me, I'd have expected the spring to the top slide to be strong enough to pull it through.
Can you force a jackpot with the mech out of the case then take another piccie?
It might be just that the top slide is failing/jammed.

If you don't know how to force a winning line, just come back and ask, we'll be more than happy to explain it in exchange for a monkey in used ... unmarked ... brown paper bag .... hollow tree ... park, I'm sure you know the drill.

BP

[bod]

Hmmm... worrying. First you want photos of my wife/girlfriend/au pair, now you want a monkey? You aren't very fussy are you? I assume you want a lady monkey - nothing strange about you I'm sure.

The picture may be a tad misleading as the post is shown pressed against the lever. When you cycle the mech the post moves fractionally forwards and the lever drops slightly. At the end it returns to the state in the picture. I've simulated a jackpot win and the post tries to move backwards and raise the lever but the slope leading edge is too low and it stops as in the photo. If I flick the lever up slightly the post then retracts properly and the lever moves right up.

I've noticed the lever also wags from side to side a little so I'm wondering if its pivot is loose or strained - but I can't really see it as it is right in the centre of the machine. As you haven't mentioned a spring or any other attachment, can I assume that the lever isn't connected to anything else, and that it just sits there waiting for the post on the top slide to raise it up?

[badpenny]

I'm sure your wife, girl friend and au pair would be impressed to hear someone who admires them would be weird.
I was in a stable relationship once, some of those horses can be quite nice can't they?

No the lever has no other attachment. From what you say it clearly must be the ramp is jamming behind the post.
Now that is weird, I've never come across that before.

These photos are from one of my Mills, cycle at rest, non winning line.....

You'll notice that at rest the lever is suspended and is held there by the stop in the second photo.
I'd guess the screw at the back which keeps the lever elevated may be missing on yours?
If so it should be easy enough to cobble something up using a steam hammer and a thermic lance.

BP

[coppinpr]

the only time ive seen the JP lever jam against the slide pillar is when a new slide has been inserted (usually because of a coin type change) and the pillar is too tall, only other thing I can think of is the JP slide is sticky or has a duff spring,this might well be the case as the JP slide dosnt get a lot of use. If it is too tall bend the ramp a little, as it says in the Mills guide " bending was always part of the making and servicing of mills machines" (I actually have a set of Mills metal benders) just take care when doing it. I suspect that is why there was a small extension to the ramp making its start point higher.

When you did your part strip down you really went the wrong way, you left the slides and removed the fingers, the slides should be the first ones out, they WILL need cleaning, there may be oil or grease on them which needs removing.
They are easy to remove, coin tube off, top slide plate off, remove the slides one at a time releasing the spring at the rear , keep in the correct order just to be safe. clean and polish the slides and the base plate under them, take this opportunity to check the horizontal fingers are all free and working on there springs, check the slide springs (especially that top one) replace the slides (make or buy a spring puller it will save you a ton of time and curses)

[bod]

I've never been out with a horse Badpenny. I've asked a few out, but they all said "neigh".

Your photo was most useful, and I think we have identified the problem. See a similar shot of my machine below...

I appear to be missing the screw or bolt that fits in the hole, the head of which supports the fingery bit at the back of my lever and holds it at the correct height to be raised by the post on top of the slide.
All I need is a suitable screw/bolt and a left-handed gooseneck screwdriver with which to fit it. I also appear to be devoid of the spring and notched post shown in your photo - are these of any importance to me?

Thanks for the info on removing the slides Coppinpr, I hadn't realised they were that easy. I'd seen a mass of levers and springs in the middle of the machine and bottled out. The payouts currently seem Ok so I didn't need to face removing the slides or the fingers. Also the reason I started with the levers at the side was that they were the most gummed up with grease. The coin detect lever was stuck pretty solid, resulting in the machine effectively being on 'free-play'. However the next time I'm feeling like getting down and dirty with a slottie I might have a go at the slides.

Now I'm off to sort through my big jar of nuts, bolts and screws to see if I can get this jackpot to function.

Thank you both for your time and assistance.

Bod

[badpenny]

That's good!
As for the notched post and knackered spring, it's probably the safety valve on the nuclear pile .... in other words I didn't bother looking.

That particular machine is an early Hi-Top so it may not be relevant to yours. I had to move 4 other bandits to get enough room to swivel that one around and slide the mech out onto madam's French Polished table (lucky it's only an old one that used to belong to her Great Grandmother).

So unless somebody else can identify it I'll happily drag it all out again for a shufty
Actually I suspect it may be connected to the hook lever that sits to the left of the payout tube and engages with the JP. It blocks the vane on the clock when you remove the mechanism from the cabinet. However I could be wrong, and often am .... ask any of my ex wives.

[bod]

You appear to trade wives like you do slot machines. I assume they eventually got fed up with being stored 4-deep in the garage? Slot machines are more patient.

I don't think the post and spring are anything to do with the hook lever that stops the fan. I was introduced to that feature some time ago when I removed the mech from the cabinet and activated it, only for not-very-much to happen. Having eventually stumbled across it, I find it quite useful, and I can vouch it works without that post and spring at the back (on mine). Of course yours may be slightly different.

[badpenny]

You appear to trade wives like you do slot machines.... .

Not at all bod, I've never lost a penny on wives, I put it down to their being so pleased to see me gone, whereas if you search this site you'll notice I've even given machines away free.

I've gone for a walk around inside my Hi-top and that serrated post is mounted on the top of the slide release, the one that gives the final clunk at the end of the cycle.
The slide release is governed by the clock and is the final action the clock makes. The other end of the spring is secured to the top of the Slides Bracket.
It appears that as the cycle is wound back when you pull the handle down it helps the slide release locate properly behind all of the slides.