Harper cigarette vending machines

American, British, French or German? We want to know about it.
aristomatic
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Re: Harper Automatics De Luxe saleman's mechanism

Post by aristomatic »

Nice item and welcome to the forum!
Love to see salesman samples, particularly with original carrying case.
Do you have any original flyers for Dean's vending machines that you could share with us? I have had a few Dean's machines over the years.
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Re: Harper Automatics De Luxe saleman's mechanism

Post by pennymachines »

Yes - nice historical artefact. Thanks for posting and welcome.
tallstory
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Re: Harper Automatics De Luxe saleman's mechanism

Post by tallstory »

What a fascinating device. I'd love to see it working |/XX\|
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treefrog
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Re: Harper Automatics De Luxe saleman's mechanism

Post by treefrog »

The days when there was pride in making items to a high standard, to even make a quality case to carry it in.

I assume this was not a coin acceptor that slotted into the machine like some other later types, but the frame was just to display the mechanism. I think all the Harper machines I have seen have them built in.

Interesting the below vendor sold two days ago for £400 as SAS auctions and unusually was painted, rather than plated like most of the larger machines. Great patina, the same machine sold at the Elephant 3 years earlier for £1100
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97934547-11F7-4248-894F-9E188C0FD943.jpeg
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gameswat
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Re: Harper Automatics De Luxe saleman's mechanism

Post by gameswat »

treefrog wrote: Fri Apr 02, 2021 7:27 am to even make a quality case to carry it in.
In fact Tree these type cases are the cheapest imaginable, just pressed cardboard with faux leather graining.
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daveslot
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by daveslot »

Thought I would share my salesman's sample cigarette machine. I presume it's a Harpers.
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IMG_20210212_142254.jpg
aristomatic
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by aristomatic »

Very nice, thanks for posting.
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gameswat
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by gameswat »

Dave, so your machine is smaller than normal then? :!?!: Needs something for scale.
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daveslot
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by daveslot »

Under 14 inches high.
clairelucas
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by clairelucas »

Hi,

Thought I would share this Harper Automatic Machine from the collection at Rustington Museum. Back in November 2019, we had the opportunity to take one of the sections out as we were remounting it for display. It was also an opportunity to take some photos of the bits very rarely seen!

We hope to open on May 17th, if anyone wants to see it in person.

Enjoy :)

Claire Lucas
Museum Manager
Rustington Museum

(The Museum holds the copyright for all the photos of this machine - please contact if you would like to use them in any way - clairelucas@rustingtonpc.org)
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close-up of the mechanism
close-up of the mechanism
back of the central section
back of the central section
original guarantee sticker found inside
original guarantee sticker found inside
The whole machine mounted on the wall
The whole machine mounted on the wall
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treefrog
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by treefrog »

Thanks for sharing Claire. Another variant and a lovely example. I love the colour scheme, reminds me of the sort of colours a bus garage would have used. !THUMBS!
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brigham
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by brigham »

SOUTHDOWN comes to mind...
pennymachines
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by pennymachines »

I recently received the following from a grandson of Percy Harper:
[Percy] died a few months before I was born in 1960. My mother was his daughter who married the local GP. I have a few photos I could share of Percy and one of his house in Purley at the height of his success with his machines...
Here’s a photo of Percy Harper’s family home called Hill Barn opposite the Purley golf club in Surrey. This was taken in the early '30s I believe. He patented the mechanism that throws out dud coins making cigarette machines viable.

PercyHarpersHome-coloured.jpg
PercyHarpersHome-coloured.jpg (196.27 KiB) Viewed 1359 times

I've previously examined Percy's coin acceptor patents.The earliest was GB321842 (1929). Others include GB326911 (1930) and GB431181 (1935).

There are patents for coin freed goods delivery dating back to the 1890s (and earlier), e.g. CA37318 (1891), but there was a slew of patents in the following decades for better coin discrimination and this really hotted up in the early '30s, allowing more valuable products to be vended. If you ask google for the first cigarette vendor, currently it returns references to a William Briggs' 1909 patent US917997A for "the first automatic cigarette vending machine", but this turns out to be a stamp/paper-label vendor.

Currently the best contender seems to be American, William Henry Rowe's* cigarette vendor of 1926. (*Whose company became Rowe Vending Machine Co Inc., ROWE MFG CO INC., ROWE AC Services, before amalgamating with AMI to form Rowe-AMI of jukebox fame).
1920s-william-rowe-cigarette-table_1_f0f43c194901fd9e32f2c6f190d5f32a.jpg
1920s-william-rowe-cigarette-table_1_f0f43c194901fd9e32f2c6f190d5f32a.jpg (203.29 KiB) Viewed 1359 times

(Image from Worthpoint)

Of course, tobacco vending via coin-operated 'honesty boxes' goes back much further.

Without doubt, Harper was the foremost designer and maker of cigarette vendors in the UK, producing an amazing variety of innovative, robustly built machines over a long period.
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coppinpr
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by coppinpr »

Not quite on topic (but close) I was looking at some of the early photos of the vendors and wondered why Woodbines were originally called "Wild Woodbines". My first assumption was they were named after the Eurasian plant which would make sense (in a way), but I can find no mention of the plant in the Woodbine history. They are, of course, named after the man who invented the cigarette, English industrialist Frank Woodbine (he has much to answer for). So I still don't know why they were called "Wild Woodbines".

If you think fags are bad now this is a description of the original process
By 1870 he had perfected his new invention, the cigarette, by crushing tobacco leaves and mixing them with asbestos, coal dust and bitumen he had created the first method of tobacco smoking which didn't require a pipe and was far cheaper than the cigar.
He got the idea while visiting the USA looking for ways to keep the lower classes in line :o
I do like this early advertising slogan
A packet of 20 Woodbines Full Strength Cigarettes is the ideal reason to carry matches!
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john t peterson
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by john t peterson »

"...crushing tobacco leaves and mixing them with asbestos, coal dust and bitumen..."

Ye Gods! Cigarettes have been called coffin nails. Those early butts were surely body bullets, .45 caliber. I can see the follow-on ads now: "I prefer my asbestos with a touch of menthol."

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brigham
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by brigham »

I can safely say that I have NEVER heard of Frank Woodbine.

Frank Woolworth, now, I've certainly heard of!
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coppinpr
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by coppinpr »

brigham wrote: Wed Feb 01, 2023 5:41 pmI can safely say that I have NEVER heard of Frank Woodbine
Well you have now. Goes to prove, you learn something every day!

Personally, I don't believe any of it is true (although it's true fags do contain a form of bitumen). In fact there is a more than dubious feel to the internet info quoted below, like the initials of the man. Was he really called F.A.G Woodbine? :lol: Truth is the first fag came out in 1821, in Turkey ,was named Muratti, and is still sold today 202 years later, Woodbine WERE named after the Eurasian plant "Wild Woodbine" (better known to us as honeysuckle), but I STILL don't know why. !PUZZLED!
Woodbines were produced as the result of the industrialist Frank Arthur Gary Woodbine’s visit to America in 1862 to study new methods of crushing the proletariat. It was while visiting Phillip Morris’s tobacco plantations in the Fall of that year that the idea for Woodbines was born.

Until this time, vital, nourishing tobacco - the only natural source of vitamin N – was only available from chemists in small tins or in the form of the expensive cigar. Woodbine realised that his work force, which was taking up to 30 trips to the local chemists per day, would become far more productive if they could take their tobacco while they worked.

During his visit to Virginia he discovered that the locals, who were too poor to buy pipes to smoke tobacco, wrapped their tobacco in old newspaper. By 1870 he had perfected his new invention, the cigarette, by crushing tobacco leaves and mixing them with asbestos, coal dust and bitumen he had created the first method of tobacco smoking which didn't require a pipe and was far cheaper than the cigar.
13rebel
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by 13rebel »

The machine in Rustington museum posted by Claire Lucas can also be seen here, earlier in this topic. Dated September 5th 2019.
pennymachines
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by pennymachines »

coppinpr wrote: Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:03 pm Personally, I don't believe any of it is true
It isn't. File under fake news, misinformation, disinformation, hoax or satire. It's from a spoof of Wikipedia called Uncyclopedia.
There was no industrialist called Frank Arthur Gary Woodbine.

According to Wikipedia, (which isn't the most reliable source on such matters):
Woodbine cigarettes are named after the woodbine flowers, native to Eurasia
coppinpr wrote: Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:03 pm Truth is the first fag came out in 1821, in Turkey, was named Muratti
I don't buy that either. Muratti was founded in 1821 as a tobacco trader, but cigarettes were around long before that. Mass production started after James Bonsack invented cigarette making machinery in 1880 (patent US238640A).

Britannica whose brand is built upon providing trustworthy, scholarly, fact-checked information 'for more than 250 years' says:
Early in the 16th century beggars in Sevilla (Seville) began to pick up discarded cigar butts, shred them, and roll them in scraps of paper (Spanish papeletes) for smoking, thus improvising the first cigarettes. These poor man’s smokes were known as cigarrillos (Spanish: “little cigars”). Late in the 18th century they acquired respectability and their use spread to Italy and Portugal; they were carried by Portuguese traders to the Levant and Russia. French and British troops in the Napoleonic Wars became familiar with them; the French named them cigarettes. Forty years later another generation of French and British troops, fighting in the Crimean War, made the acquaintance of Turkish cigarettes. At the same time, cigarettes were becoming popular in the United States. British taste later switched to cigarettes filled with unmixed Virginia tobacco, but the U.S. market developed a preference for a blend including some Turkish tobacco.
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Re: Harper Vending Machines

Post by pennymachines »

pennymachines wrote: Tue Jan 31, 2023 12:32 am Currently the best contender seems to be American, William Henry Rowe's* cigarette vendor of 1926. (*Whose company became Rowe Vending Machine Co Inc., ROWE MFG CO INC., ROWE AC Services, before amalgamating with AMI to form Rowe-AMI of jukebox fame).
I see we have a British Garrett cigarette vendor with a 1924 patent (GB220969).

It seems likely there are earlier examples; from vending stamps (or the like) to vending cigarettes required no technical advance.
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