Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

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speedwell
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Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by speedwell »

2 attractive machines on Ebay from Bullion993. The pin up machine has an interesting mech. On another site referring to same machine suggests work needs doing. eBay item number:353499460347

I say nothing about the Girls!
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treefrog
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by treefrog »

What other site as obviously we are unable to know what they refer to. !PUZZLED!
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moonriver
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by moonriver »

The Pin up Girl doesn't appear to have a bell.
speedwell
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by speedwell »

Sorry treefrog. I went on a header on Allwin for sale in UK | 30 second-hand Allwins - For-sale.co.uk https://www.for-sale.co.uk › allwin when I put in "pin up girl made by bussoz paris 1914". The header suggested work needed doing, but when I looked closely nothing in the body of the post. On the contrary the seller indicates both machines in good condition. What's your view on the machines? Both are beyond me but I would be interested to know views and anything about them.
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moonriver
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by moonriver »

I noticed a bid on the Pin up Girl of £999.99 was retracted yesterday and instantly brought the bid back down with a bump, now climbing again. I have a distrust of 'private listing-bidder identity protected' listings in general, as a lot can be manipulated with those and you can't see if any of those bidders are zero or single digit fake bidders running up the bid.
I think genuine sellers using the private listings option harm the potential of their sale. It is reassuring for bidders to see others with plenty of previous bid history especially where there is a string of rounded up bids neatly spaced apart.
speedwell
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by speedwell »

I could not agree more. When Ebay introduced it they hailed it as fraud prevention device. That is rubbish and it does the opposite. As Moonriver points out ,with names and previous history it was fairly easy to catch the false bidding out. I suppose the only way is ( perhaps as ever) set your limit and keep to it whatever the others bid. I was an under bidder on a number of occasions and was within a very short time contacted to say the 'winner' had pulled out. You can guess my reply. I prefer now to use something like hammersnipe. It helps keep my itchy figures away!
On the actual machines does anyone have any historical information/ views about them? I like the look of both.
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badpenny
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by badpenny »

The fact nobody else seems to want to share their views on these two machines indicates to me many covetous eyes are casting insatiable desirables in their direction. I predict that many out there are hoping not many have noticed them and the low prices showing so far are an indication of impending bargains.
I'd bet my Grannie's hind leg that the vendor has received umpteen mails daily offering him wedges of folding to take them off auction with immediate effect.
The temptation to do so must be high, especially if you calculate the fees. Suppose PayPoo is used? He doesn't say cash only.

So, two rare machines very rarely offered, images look excellent, someone should be happy with the outcome.
It won't be me, I would have valued them at well over a grand each before this period of £850 Arcadians and £1450 R&W Allwins.
So currently? Anyone's guess, I'll watch, out of entertainment of course.
Good luck everyone, your first hurdle is the auctions staying until the end. If they do then the last few seconds could be heady.

BP !!HIDING!!
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moonriver
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by moonriver »

well you've managed to big those up nicely, i'll let you know when i'm next selling something SkEpTiCaL
pennymachines
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by pennymachines »

speedwell wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 6:59 pm On the actual machines does anyone have any historical information/ views about them? I like the look of both.
The Iris was introduced in 1931 by Jentzsch & Meerz of Leipzig and is more or less a clone of the French-made roulette wall machines of Bussoz and others that had already been popular for three decades. These usually had a carved pediment, but Iris didn't - I assume this has been added. They're not impossibly rare in the UK, but certainly not common either.

iris.jpg
iris.jpg (37.61 KiB) Viewed 2446 times

The Pin Up Girl was a Bussoz 'roulette' originally, called Girouette. To make them more appealing in British arcades they were revamped and anglicized by the Exclusive Automatics Co. (new case, mech converted to penny, bigger turning handle, with a plainer, more modern looking cabinet). See example in Museum.
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PinUp.jpg
PinUp.jpg (35.83 KiB) Viewed 2446 times
speedwell
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by speedwell »

Thank You Mr. PM. A fount of knowledge as always.
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badpenny
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by badpenny »

moonriver wrote: Thu May 20, 2021 11:32 pm well you've managed to big those up nicely, i'll let you know when i'm next selling something SkEpTiCaL
I don't know what's wrong with me.
I've been told enough times how my humble opinion has affected world activities.
I've always regretted criticising that nice Mr. Hitler's moustache back in the 1930s. Who was to know what he'd go on to do after?
Mostly though, call me naive, but I was astonished when 300K Native Americans were driven out of their lands in California during the gold rush on account of nobody having yet realised how popular gold was until I asked why funeral directors had a shoe box with gold teeth in.

BP :dammit:
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treefrog
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by treefrog »

I suspect this thread has turned this way due to that “unwritten rule” not to discuss items for sale before they have sold. Those watching the items, who would be many would not want to comment on condition, interest, value etc and those not interested in buying are happy to respond :HaHa:

I suspect original poster was probing and hoping to see if anyone would comment on any serious flaws not knowing enough about the machines ( eg stating on another forum people stated flaws with the machines) and I completely understand this and all of us have been in similar situations. I have even approached people directly for help in similar situations, but of course not considered those people may want it themselves, as such this is for ever the collectors dilemma... :#:

I fancy them, well the pin up girl as who can turn down a sexy bikini clad lady from the 60’s, but will be blown out of the water in this crazy market....other issue of course is dissing a machine a fellow collector may be trying to sell, I try real hard not to be overly critical anymore, it has happened to me before and you sit there pulling your teeth out in frustration, except where someone is intentionally pulling the wool over ones eyes.....

So go for them, nice looking machines !!THUMBSX2!!

Fun this hobby :woops:
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badpenny
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by badpenny »

We have this conversation every year usually.
And nothing changes, the only way to win an auction is to place the highest bid, and with eBay it doesn't have to be at the end.
All you have to do is agree what it's worth to you and you can bid that at the very beginning, never look at it again, and you can still win.

The biggest weakness is those that don't play the game, vendors that use the auction house as a marketing tool and sell it off the site.
We used to suffer that one with the live auctions as well. Either the crowd drawer wouldn't survive the journey from the car park to the trestle table inside or a very high reserve would be set, and then sold in the car park afterwards.
The conflict between the vendor wanting the best price and the buyer the cheapest will always produce odd opinions on what constitutes acceptable behaviour.
13rebel
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by 13rebel »

Mr PM has said that the 'Iris' didn't have a pediment yet on page 66 of the 'Arcadia' book it shows an Iris with pediment, though it is a different style. !PUZZLED!
pennymachines
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by pennymachines »

That one is definitely non standard. Compare it to this early line drawing from Alte-Spielautomaten:

Original Iris
Original Iris

Apart from the typically Bussoz-style carved pediment, the front door has either been made of a single timber or, more likely, veneered; a third central door hinge; the instruction frame is inverted; the payout cup displaced to the side, and the coin slots are different. Presumably this was all done after it was imported and converted to French coinage. It's possible a French collector had a spare Bussoz pediment and thought it looked good atop this game. :!?!:

From 'Arcadia'
From 'Arcadia'

The pediment on the eBay example looks modern to my eyes. Is the relief carved or a machine-made moulding glued to a backing? I don't think it's typical of any wall machine pediment I've seen, and I'm sure it doesn't belong on this one. It was probably added because the Iris resembles the French roulettes which usually did sport pediments. Of course, it wouldn't be a problem to remove it.
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13rebel
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Re: Pin Up and Iris Wall machine

Post by 13rebel »

Ah I see what you mean. Thanks Mr.PM.
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